Spirituality’s Gender Differences - ??
First, a distinction:
For working definitions, let’s use the word “psychology” to point to our individual temperaments or personalities. This includes our distinctive styles or ways of expressing both our positive characteristics and negative attributes – those “issues” needing work.
Let’s call “spirituality” something like "our essential humanity at its best" in order to stay away from connotations this word has of immortal soul, non-materialism etc., which people differ on and isn’t the focus of this post.
Most people seem to see psychological gender differences. I find that if I try to articulate them, it isn't so easy.
Do you see psychological gender differences? Can you say what they are?
What about spiritual gender differences – any such thing?
________
Thanks to those who inquire from time to time about how to purchase Original Faith. When it's available, this site will be modified and readers will be able to order the book here or at Amazon.com.
Oceanshamman, thanks for the citation on your recent post on blogs you like to read. Oceanshamman’s link is on the right under my blog roll.
For working definitions, let’s use the word “psychology” to point to our individual temperaments or personalities. This includes our distinctive styles or ways of expressing both our positive characteristics and negative attributes – those “issues” needing work.
Let’s call “spirituality” something like "our essential humanity at its best" in order to stay away from connotations this word has of immortal soul, non-materialism etc., which people differ on and isn’t the focus of this post.
Most people seem to see psychological gender differences. I find that if I try to articulate them, it isn't so easy.
Do you see psychological gender differences? Can you say what they are?
What about spiritual gender differences – any such thing?
________
Thanks to those who inquire from time to time about how to purchase Original Faith. When it's available, this site will be modified and readers will be able to order the book here or at Amazon.com.
Oceanshamman, thanks for the citation on your recent post on blogs you like to read. Oceanshamman’s link is on the right under my blog roll.
Posted by Paul at 12:24 PM Permalink
22 Comments:
Good questions. I don't believe their are any natural differences. The differences that we do see are of our making. Usually a result of our culture.
I do believe that there are differences, just as there are differences in male and female energies. Also people who may be working with a nice mix of male and female energies, awesome spiritually when they are balanced but difficult to do.
I find male energy to be stronger in an upfront way. People tend to feel male energy as a stronger energy. Where, the female energy is a more subtle and comforting but just as strong. Many times stronger because of our connection to emotions. Many males in this day and age, a culture thing again, have been taught to separate themselves from their feelings and emotions from an early age. Very sad thing for men, not good for themselves and relationships later in life.
So differences, yes but that's what this world is so rich for. We're all different even in segregating male and female this way. There's something for everyone when it comes to personal spirituality :)
namaste
Nancy
waterfall
WRT spirtuality: doesn't your definition kinda exclude the possibility that men and women could exhibit significant spiritual differences?
As it stands, I'm still looking for the "interesting question" about the differences between men and women.
I had a thought--at what point does our spiritual nature completely pervade the psychological nature and what does that lead to? I personally think it is a given that our psychological make-up leads to some kind of gender bias. Yet when we look at the masters we see almost androgenous people...I'm thinking for some reason of Walt Whitman (I know...who thinks of him as a master?). But at what point does your spirit surpass your mind and body and what happens to gender then?
OK, to your question--if you define psychological as "expression of our distinct styles" then I would tag on with Mark about our environment and culture. What was the gender role we grew up with and how did we incorporate that into our persona? Are men from mars and women from venus really?
Darcy
i do believe that differences between male and female have their roots largely in gender roles, which emanate largely from culture, socialization. and that our individual psychology "spices" those roles.
That said, i believe that biology - i.e. hormonal differences between the sexs - does manifest itself in terms of distinct male and female psychology. its in the science - testosterone has an association with certain types of behaviours and estrogen, progesterone, others. women function as vessels to the human race, men do not.
i cannot say there are no natural differences, knowing the underlying biology and physiology. i believe that biology and physiology influence psychology and sociology. at some point the waters become muddied and the two converge.
as for spiritual differences ... i have an intuitive sense of what you mean and i am one the fence about that one. in one sense, i do ... and yet ... i see one cannot necessarily universally apply such differences.
does this make any sense?
keshi.
I have always felt that gender differences were due to a combination of nature and nurture. Someone brought up testosterone. Good example of how nature can determine some traits. This reminds me that men change as they get older and their testosterone levels go down. I have seen it happen with my husband. He is less competitive.
Just a thought.
Blame Darcy, lol. The topic came up on one of her discussion threads. That said…
MARK: I tend to think it may be more like there are some basic psychological – not so sure about spiritual – differences. Then these get exaggerated by culture. Otherwise, to me, it’s hard to explain how the cultural differences got going - ? Also, seems like the gender differences around the world show a lot of similarity. But as someone else here mentions, he’s no sociologist etc. Me either…
WATERFALLS: I’ve heard things along those lines – the idea of androgyny in spirituality and creativity. I also have the sense that there are psychological differences – but inclined to think not spiritual.
“Energy” is a good word to suggest that sense we may have of gender differences, but I’m not so sure it explains them. It’s kind of like saying that geese have geese energy and ducks have duck energy and that’s why they behave differently. This is actually just another way of saying that ducks and geese are different, and not an explanation of the difference. If the psyches of men and women are different, saying that it’s because they have different energies is a longer way of saying that they’re different without explaining why - does that make sense?
MATTHEW: Yeah, I’d see the psychological differences in terms of trends too – maybe certain basic biological differences that generally result in somewhat different psychological and behavioral predispositions which then become magnified by social expectations.
Good point, and that did cross my mind – that using a working definition of spirituality as "our essential humanity at its best" could be viewed as tautological because features of our “essential humanity” would by definition be shared by both sexes.
To make this non tautological would require identifying something like “the elements of spirituality.” If, for example, love or faith or self-transcendence could be adequately described, we could then look at them and ask: does a woman’s love, a woman’s faith, a woman’s self-transcendence, differ from a man’s?
DARCY: That relationship – or interrelationship – between the psychological and spiritual is an interesting one. Does our spiritual nature come to pervade our psychological nature or displace it? Semantics?
In any case, I do think there’s something bigger than our personalities that we’re called to live for.
RED M: Hadn’t thought of that – that the socially prescribed gender roles could be fundamental, with individual psychology enhancing that. Is it just me or wouldn’t the chicken have to lay the egg here? That is, didn’t society originate with individuals? But I don’t know, maybe it really is a classic chicken/egg problem. The two – human individuals and human society – must actually be equally ancient. I mean, as soon as humans were human they must have been socializing. No doubt our immediate ancestors – “Homoprecursor” – (as long as I don’t actually know much in this area, this seems like a reasonable word to me…) – also must have lived in societies of some kind, even if it was just to get together for banana picking.
Don’t worry, my next post won’t be on archaeology… On spiritual differences, see the second two paragraphs in my reply to Matthew above, which is archaeology-free.
KESHI: I think I know what you mean and would tend to agree there.
SUSIEQ: Why do I want to defend your husband here, LOL??
VISHESH: Sounds like you mean that you don’t see spiritual differences – or psychological differences?
EMERGING FIRE: Interesting thought. If we manage to avoid destroying our own environment and last a long time, who knows? Sex itself, if I recall correctly, came along pretty recently in the history of life on earth. It might become outmoded! What will they do for scandals though?
As for gender differences in ones spiritual nature, I would be inclined to say there is none. Over the years, I have had numerous people who have not met me in RL,ask me my gender as they can not discern it from my writings.
Psychologically, I am sure there is a difference as we evolved with different roles, different skills to bring to the table. Much of our inter-gender problems stem from that. The two genders are the opposite sides of the SAME coin as far as I can see.
A very interesting question......Z
Not so keen on the distinction, sorry to fall into somantics on an otherwise beautiful morning.
Spirituality can be very hard to define, it can be boilded down to a set of beliefs or creed embodied by a being. The at it's best, is a little off putting as any creed or life style has the potential to be detrimental.
I would lean more towards plato and the soul, or essence of a being, indestructable and immutable, which defines us on a level outside of the Physiological or physchological.
To the question at hand though.... It is hard to define psychological gender differences without falling into the trap of Stereotypes, IE. Men dont listen and women cant read maps.
Given the current climate where it now ok to say, hey I like other guys/girls/Transformers these boundries are even harder to define. The best option is to treat every one like an individual.
Spiritual differences, Some churches ( i wont be specific) would say yes, years of misogynistic rhetoric and teachings will see to that. I believe though the spirit or soul is the universal constant, on that level we are all the same.
Sorry about the novel you can have your blog back now.
Aidan
Darcy, great point!
I believe what I see in the masters is a combining of male and female energies as there is both in all of us but usually one side is more dominant. I see the male body of the master projecting a more softer, loving, nurturing, sensitive nature. The woman master projects more of an authority and strength. I guess I’m just having problems with the word androgynous that means to me, the taking away of sexuality.
I see masters as having embodied both sexes bringing both traits forward. So they are fully empowered male and female. Semantics I guess :)
Paul, the energies here are manifesting different, in the physical, l believe because yes we have incarnated into male and female bodies….which are different. Manifesting into these bodies is to experience. If we were all the same mix of male and female then it would be a different experience here on Earth *smile*
On Ducks and Geese I feel the different species of animals as different. As I find each individual animal as having a different energy…just as people.
Does their energy come from a different source as us? Will we return to a different pool of soul energy in the end? I’m not so sure that anything will be in a different pool of energy if this reality decides to refresh and start again… even the rocks, trees, dirt….
All those experiences getting blended up for us to do it all over again.
Btw what was the original question? LOL
Oh yeah… maybe my answer after all of that is experiences. How experiences as individual energies/souls/spirits are impacted by the experiences we have. Did we all start out the same I would be inclined to think Yes.
I don't know about a difference in spirituality, the way you define it. In a religious sense, behavior seems a little different - I've read more women tend to go to church, retreats, etc. but I don't know if that's due to an intrinisc difference or a cultural one.
i feel the differences whatever they are only till an extent,then our powers become equal...
we should remember that the differences(physical and physiological) are because of evolution....if our fore fathers and mothers had behaved in a different way,i.e. say the women hunted than the physique will be different....as for the differences in sexes,we see in all animals there is a difference and that the feminine is considered higher...that why i feel everything is the same in the end...like all of us are energy...
AIDAN: Yes, “spirituality” is hard to define. I agree that equating it with specific beliefs doesn’t seem to make sense since there are so many different and even contradictory religious beliefs. Belief in an immortal and immaterial soul, sometimes conceived as personal and even having a body, other times as the drop returning to the ocean etc., would be one of the many beliefs that can be associated with “spirituality.”
So to me, it's helpful to look directly at experience itself rather than confine ourselves to debating the various associated beliefs. By looking at experience, it seems to me we’re more likely to notice things we share. I think love – again, hard to define – is a good example of what I’d want to call a spiritual experience.
Like you, I think that the spiritual level of experience can be distinguished from the psychological - by the sheer quality and magnitude of the experiences involved.
RED M: At what point did the circle start, lol? I don’t know either…
WATERFALLS: Sounds like you’re outlining a specific belief system. Many, probably most of us, closely identify our spirituality with a set of beliefs.
As to “energy,” “vital force” etc, what I’d want to say here is that whether or not we believe in this, it doesn’t have explanatory power. Why is someone female? Because they have female energy. Why does someone have female energy? Because they’re female. The two terms are defined by each other. It’s kind of like saying, Why do I have brown hair? Because my hair is brown. Why is my hair brown? Because I have brown hair.
The sense you have of the unity of things is found in many belief systems and, imo, is grounded in direct experience. It also finds support in observations about the physical world. It really is a UNI-verse. Things interconnect.
CRYSTAL: That makes sense – that studying religious behavior defined as attending church services, going on retreats etc, might yield clearer gender differences than trying to study spirituality. Much easier to define the terms for one thing!
VISHESH: Your basic idea here is how I look at it too – that psychological gender differences are superficial relative to what the sexes hold in common at our spiritual depths.
Aha, I like that formulation better! But when I try to define those things, the question of spiritual difference always ends up reducing to the question of pychological and sociological trends.
To pick a single example: straight evangelical Christian women experience and conceive of God in a significantly different way than straight evangelical Christian men, because straight women are attracted to men (biological factor) and God is almost always described using male language (environmental factor).
I guess a dualist like Plato might want to speculate about whether the Souls of women are made of different stuff than the Souls of men, but I'm pretty much a materialist, so I can just pass on that question, or maybe reinterpret it in a way that lets us get some biological or environmental handles on it.
"The spirit is simple but the flesh is complicated." Maybe not an exact quote...
As Waterfalls insights pointed out, there are differences in male and female energies. For some reason over the past week, I have become extremely aware of a difference in male/female spirituality, but most of it revolving around my MOTHERHOOD. So it gets back to, does spirit actually have a gender bias, or is it how spirit manifests itself that has the bias? Looking at the different Indian Gurus, there is a distinct difference in the females vs. the males, and I wonder, where does the mythological linear vs. circular landscape come in to play here. This post may be past comments, but I'd be interested in thoughts...
My own best guess, nothing more, is that mythology is a colorful blend of the psychological and the spiritual and that if you distinguish the psychological and spiritual dimensions of experience, you find that the colorful differences, including gender differences, stem from psychology (and, more fundamentally, biology). This conjecture is based mainly on having read my own book! It doesn’t address this directly, but I think it could be inferred.
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