EZ Listening Religion & Spirituality
Please note: In what follows, I'm not rejecting concepts like blessing, grace, or God's purpose for one's life; I'm rejecting what strike me as misunderstandings of these ideas.
Have you been good? Then you're so very special that God won't let YOU suffer!
In times of trouble:
Ask and you will receive. Receive what?
Guidance toward your soul mate, resolution of marital problems, a meaningful career, restored heath – or even, with “prosperity theology,” more stuff!
Grace, grace, abundant grace! Only open yourself up to it and all will be well.
Turn to the angels and no harm can come . . .
Only believe . . .
In good fortune:
I’m blessed . . .
Heaven and earth support those who pray to the Lord!
We’ve led good lives; God has opened doors for us.
I survived the crash because God has a special purpose for me - and apparently not for those other folks that got killed.
In Sum, and with reference to all of the above:
Blah blah blah . . .
Beyond Spiritual Materialism
Feel-good spirituality isn’t the real thing. Not all {Christians - or insert any other religious/spiritual affiliation} who get into car accidents find that they make a good recovery. Not all spiritual people are physically healthy. Not all prayers are answered. Believing in angels, saints, in Christian doctrine, or any other doctrine, is absolutely no guarantee of safety, security, health, wealth, or happiness.
If it were that easy, only the mentally incompetent would have (additional) difficulties. If ask and you will receive worked materialistically, then obviously any mentally competent person who saw all the believers asking and having and getting what they wanted would observe this, believe in it, and ask for and receive the things they wanted too.
Religion and spirituality have never been about people obtaining goodies, despite the fact that large segments of humankind have perennially tried to make it about that and supported each other in this delusion.
Blessed are those whose happiness is founded upon peace; woe to those whose peace is founded upon happiness.
Have you been good? Then you're so very special that God won't let YOU suffer!
In times of trouble:
Ask and you will receive. Receive what?
Guidance toward your soul mate, resolution of marital problems, a meaningful career, restored heath – or even, with “prosperity theology,” more stuff!
Grace, grace, abundant grace! Only open yourself up to it and all will be well.
Turn to the angels and no harm can come . . .
Only believe . . .
In good fortune:
I’m blessed . . .
Heaven and earth support those who pray to the Lord!
We’ve led good lives; God has opened doors for us.
I survived the crash because God has a special purpose for me - and apparently not for those other folks that got killed.
In Sum, and with reference to all of the above:
Blah blah blah . . .
Beyond Spiritual Materialism
Feel-good spirituality isn’t the real thing. Not all {Christians - or insert any other religious/spiritual affiliation} who get into car accidents find that they make a good recovery. Not all spiritual people are physically healthy. Not all prayers are answered. Believing in angels, saints, in Christian doctrine, or any other doctrine, is absolutely no guarantee of safety, security, health, wealth, or happiness.
If it were that easy, only the mentally incompetent would have (additional) difficulties. If ask and you will receive worked materialistically, then obviously any mentally competent person who saw all the believers asking and having and getting what they wanted would observe this, believe in it, and ask for and receive the things they wanted too.
Religion and spirituality have never been about people obtaining goodies, despite the fact that large segments of humankind have perennially tried to make it about that and supported each other in this delusion.
Blessed are those whose happiness is founded upon peace; woe to those whose peace is founded upon happiness.
Posted by Paul at 1:39 PM Permalink
36 Comments:
**Blessed are those whose happiness is founded upon peace; woe to those whose peace is founded upon happiness
Amen!
Keshi.
I mean :)
Keshi.
Thank you for visiting me at "The Benedict Notes" today. I am very happy to find your site. It looks like I have lots of exploring to do. I found the last line of this post especially meaningful. I have recently started to really study my Faith. The peace it is giving me is bringing me much happiness.
ANNIE, thank you for taking a look. Glad that last line resonated with you too. I think that when people whose basic needs are met seek happiness but still don't find it, it's precisely because they don't have their spiritual house in order, so to speak. Without that there can be fun, pleasure, distraction, but I think little happiness and certainly not a happy way of life.
I found this on Jade Purity site and thought you might like it. it said:
As long as I am this or that, or have this or that, I am not all things and I have not all things. Become pure till you neither are nor have either this or that; then you are omnipresent and, being neither this nor that, are all things.
-Eckhart
CODAKIZ: Understanding the most basic or elemental spiritual experiences is what has mattered most to me: love, faith, ego, work, God and the way toward God.
I think "peace" and "happiness" belong in that same category of experience.
I know what you mean about what a misunderstanding it is to see spirituality as an additive; one way or another, we embrace it or run away from it.
We can only be as good as we are good. It's true, not all spiritual individuals live a happy, stress-free life, but we do have cerain karmic condtions we have to meet in this lifetime. Some of them are painful, but we learn to cope with anything God has bestowed us with. We can either complain about our life or just live it the best way we can, knowing that if we open our hearts, God will show us love and guidance. Life is all about attitude. :D
amazing
all of them hats
it reminds me of china when all the buckets explode into tambourines like that time when jelly was the source of all supernatural dreams, do you think?
buttery buggers
I guess both are blessed in their own way. A marriage of the two is probably the recipe for a balanced productive happiness.
Happiness, of course, is not to be equated with ‘obtaining goodies’.
ALEXYS: Yes, I think authentic spirituality is about attitude change and a process of becoming more aware of who we are – a process that changes our identity. And that this change goes in a direction of our increasing relationship to God.
I realize that some readers will find this word problematic, and I'm having to just toss it out here without space in a comments thread to elaborate on what I mean by God/relationship to God.
I don’t know enough about karma to comment on your thought in that area. I’ve only heard passing references to it and haven't seen a serious discussion of the idea.
AVGW: I’d need to know more what you mean by the word indifference – more like not caring, or more like “detachment” as the word is used in contemplative traditions? Also not sure what you mean by “the nutty ones,” unless Harold, lol? I think he's only trying to be funny...
So true. Also, what we pray for, what we think we want, may not be the answer we get.
I am trying to live with the answers I get that I don't like...
Wonderful post and thank you for stopping by mine.
Suzy
What I think we both reject is the notion of God as Santa Clause.
TINYTHINKER: That sure is one big thought for a “tiny thinker!” That topic could be a post, or a series of posts, in itself…
N2: Without completely understanding the “troubleshooter” idea that you point to, I think I see what you mean here about bringing on difficulty by grappling with troubles that are essentially nonsensical or made up.
SUZY: To me, your comment helps get at the complexities of real life and illustrates the falsity of what I’ve called “spiritual materialism."
I’d only add that sometimes the answers that you get that you don’t like are things that, in retrospect (it can take years...), you see were for the best. But that’s not always the case – that would be the kind of oversimplification that I think is untruthful.
BETH, thanks. Trials… Do you think that word describes all or some forms of pain and difficulty that people encounter?
For example: whether caused by other people or natural disasters; whether they happen to adults or children; mentally competent or mentally incompetent persons; and whether or not they result in death.
(You know, if you didn't get so many danged good responses so quickly...... anyway)
I get this little voice in my mind that says, "Say what?!?!" When I see the words 'spiritual' and 'materialism' so close together in a sentence. I agree with your original post - the idea that the metaphysical ether of the universe responds to our "right-here-right-now" desires is, well, simple. I think this concept spawns from the industrial revolution's version of evangelical Christianity. i.e. "If you do 'good,' you go to heaven, good things happen to you, etc. If you do 'bad,' you're going to hell, and we're here to help you get there! Fire, brimstone, blah, blah, blah."
Alexys said, "...karmic condtions we have to meet in this lifetime," then you said, "I don’t know enough about karma..." As far as I know, the entire principle of Karma can be summarized in "what goes around comes around." I take that to mean that if you seek to take from life, you may end up getting, then eventually, life will take from you... sort of the yin and yang deal.
I think you hit the nail on the head in regard to what a.v.g. was trying to express in regard to "indifference" vice "detachment." Detachment (i.e. indifference to material things) might certainly lead someone to a peaceful state. However, indifference in a general sense might only lead someone to poverty, with still no sense of satisfaction.
Regarding Lucy's comment, I agree with the premise: we do not know the design of the universe, nor our purpose in that design. However, I couldn't help but be reminded of a quote from an early 90's reggae, hip-hop song from "Arrested Development" when she mentioned that God helps us cope... "the word cope and the word change are directly opposite, not the same."
n2 pointed something out that truly resonates with me, considering my profession in information technology: "if you associate yourself with the troubleshooter, you naturally place yourself in a perpetual state of trouble." I think this also has great meaning on a spiritual level, too. It coincidentally reminds me of a guy I went to high school with who turned out to be a missionary. Talk about walking into trouble. At the same time, though... he is escaping his self-inflicted sense of trouble and bringing others who were in trouble out with him. A great metaphor in and of itself.
Something else you said, Paul, was: "Not all prayers are answered." I would have to side with Suzy on this one, when she said, "what we pray for, what we think we want, may not be the answer we get." My personal way of seeing this is that we can ask the higher power for anything... but we must be willing to accept that the answer may be, "No," or "Not right now."
As usual, great stuff, Paul. Sorry for the long-winded response... but I thought it better than a "collage" of everyone else's posts. ;-)
Thanks,
Tim
If you’re right about karma, sounds like the functional equivalent of Judgment Day – a different belief, but one that similarly serves the function of allowing the believer to see life as fair despite appearances to the contrary.
For myself, there’s some of each now – some changes, still, but a lot of coping, i.e., persevering, hanging on. There was a long period where there was a lot more growth/change than coping. Maybe it’s always some of each, but the proportions vary according to where you’re at and what you may happen to be up against, or not.
Oh… right... troubleshooting is an IT term, right? Thanks for the clarification, I’m just lucky I know how to type…
How would you distinguish a prayer not being answered from an answer of No?
Paul, if you had to choose between happiness and meaning, which would you pick at this point in your life?
EM: thanks, and for comimg by -
Very good and very interesting. What you say is true. Peace be with you!
CRYSTAL: Its gross unfairness sure is ironic. The phrase rings a bell, probably from undergrad years. It seems like a good blanket term to cover a category of misguided thinking that seems to come in many forms.
Wonder if there are any hypotheses about the hypothesis? Or maybe it's too obviously a defense mechanism to require any. (As long as I'm good, nothing bad will happen to me.)
Karma, to my understanding and further reflection, seems to fall in line with your view... though I see your view as somewhat skeptical, in that I feel life is certainly about duality, both on individual and universal scales - not just as a personal justification for circumstances.
Indeed, cope and change are married. However, that quote I referenced seemed to drive home to me the fact that the marriage of the two does not make them in and of themselves the same. We cope with change, and change helps us to cope with circumstances. Yet, coping with a situation, and the effectual change evidenced by a situation are not in and of themselves the same. Right now, I'm finding it difficult to describe with words the distinction that falls naturally in my mind.
Yes, troubleshooting can be applied in many ways... though it stands out in my mind as a structured way of identifying the root cause of a problem with a computer... again, which can also be applied to spirituality vice a piece of metal and plastic.
I guess I made my differentiation already in that an "unanswered" prayer can mean "no" as well as "not yet" (aka "wait").
I appreciate you, Paul. Thanks for spending so much time addressing these thoughts we all have.
Tim
Karma would probably fall for me in the realm of metaphysics, which I think of as our attempts to describe just how life or being works, and in considerable detail. While I find some metaphysical ideas more and others less attractive, I haven’t come across anything I’ve found compelling – had to read a lot of that in divinity school. I like the voice from the whirlwind: “Where were you when I laid the foundations of the earth?” That is, God, to Job: What on earth do YOU know? Personally, I don't experience the need for metaphysics to love, experience faith, and grow into a truer identity and relation to God
Cope/change… I don’t see them as the same either…
If I understand, you’re saying that an unanswered prayer can mean “not yet” as well as no (that is, no as in “no and never”), which is true. But of course, it often does mean no and never. People who pray not to die in battle or from a disease, for example, often do. So the distinction I don’t see is between a prayer unanswered and a prayer denied as in “No, never.”
Prayer, of course is a big topic. I don’t think I’ve ever posted on it specifically, though it’s come up a lot. The word pray doesn’t always refer to the same sorts of practices; even when it does, people often have different understandings of what’s going on in prayer.
Thanks for your thoughts as well.
SAGE, I appreciate it, thanks for stopping by.
In regard to unanswered prayer... I think it is more of a perceived non-answer than a true non-answer. Such as, "Why hasn't God answered my prayer?" Or, better yet, "Why didn't God do what I asked?" I believe that sometimes, the answer is a flat "no, never," as you mentioned. I also believe that, just because whatever request has not materialized yet, it doesn't inherently mean "no, never." It sometimes means, "the time has not been right, yet."
Wow, you've got two more really thoughtful posts I need to catch up on..... so, here I go. :)
Wait! Before I go.... I just had another thought about your reference to Job's story. I am beginning to doubt that some mystical being boomed down from the clouds to ask Job a question. I bet the reality of it was much more like what we feel today. For example, I was talking with someone about the Grand Canyon just today - and we discussed how the grandeur of the place simply cannot be described or contained or "packaged." It must be experienced to truly grasp the "wow" factor - the total awe of seeing such a massive creation (i.e. the hand of God).
I'll bet that Job's experience when watching a tornado was much the same... kind of an epiphany of sorts, where he saw and watched and his thoughts began to wander and ponder the ultimate nature of God, and his conclusion was that God would probably say to him something like, "What on earth do you know," or, "Do you think your feeble human efforts could ever contain me?"
Okay, now I'm REALLY going to check out the new posts.
Notice that in your way of thinking about prayer, no evidence could ever be cited in support of the idea that prayers ever go unanswered. On the one hand, people sometimes get what they pray for. When they don’t, it isn’t because their prayers weren’t answered; it’s because God answered with either a No or a Not Yet.
That’s essentially how I understand Job too.
u are truly blessed Paul,u have received abundant grace and have turned into such a beautiful person (as has all the others commentors too!).
true spirituality is one.this understanding grows deeper with beautiful encounters like this one. thank you.
Thanks so much for your comment, I really appreciate it.
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